John Vervaeke argues that logos is the relationship between recursive [[Relevance realization]] (our ability to seek meaning in our lives) and [[Ontonormativity]], the really real. "Gather things together so they belong together" ![[After Socrates Episode 5 - Finite Transcendence Dr. John Vervaeke#^c9kd70]] - We're all drawn together through the logos, to value and experience what is most real? - ![[After Socrates Episode 5 - Finite Transcendence Dr. John Vervaeke#^ig41bs]] - Agent as us, arena as in scenario, alathea as the revealing of what is most real? Another perspective, based on Antisthenes that defines the logos as: ![[After Socrates Episode 9 - Metanoia Dr. John Vervaeke#^yh8t9f]] This helps see the logos in more of a non-propositional and non-definitional nature, one that is more experiential compared to Plato's and the forms. How is this definition different? ![[After Socrates Episode 9 - Metanoia Dr. John Vervaeke#^lep12l]] Plato's propositional definition of the logos helps us discover universal truths, but we may do so at the expense of our own connectedness to it. It reminds me of how if we are productive for the sake of optimization and excelling in societal norms, then there's a higher chance we feel disconnected from the meaning behind our progress. To combat this, we can take on the different definition of [[Wisdom]]: ![[After Socrates Episode 9 - Metanoia Dr. John Vervaeke#^fpdqx3]] But with this definition, words are then used to show, not tell. To promote participation in the definition and connection to ourselves, to take upon a practice to transform. ![[After Socrates Episode 9 - Metanoia Dr. John Vervaeke#^8e93lt]] - Encourages us to compare between whether it's "is" or "was", a practice, not a definition ![[After Socrates Episode 9 - Metanoia Dr. John Vervaeke#^ol7gqo]] This is what it means to have these two forms of wisdom engage in opponent processing, as they're practiced in different ways. It sounds like the spectrum of [[Types of Knowing]]. ![[After Socrates Episode 9 - Metanoia Dr. John Vervaeke#^u70yl2]] This labor results in deeper [[Connectedness]], the horizontal axis of [[Socratic dialogue]]: ![[After Socrates Episode 9 - Metanoia Dr. John Vervaeke#^pqzzlg]] How is this done? ![[After Socrates Episode 9 - Metanoia Dr. John Vervaeke#^zpa20s]] Some example practices include [[Improv]] ![[After Socrates Episode 9 - Metanoia Dr. John Vervaeke#^sx5sdp]] ![[After Socrates Episode 9 - Metanoia Dr. John Vervaeke#^p7kmzd]]